Thursday, April 26, 2012

Luke, Ben and Derrick Round Table: Timberwolves Have a 1st Round Pick

[caption id="" align="aligncenter" width="600" caption="Wes hasn't been the answer on the wing, will Utah's pick bring that wing to Minny?"][/caption]

This is an email round table discussion between Ben, Luke (part-time contributor and TPup fanatic) and Derrick.  The topic of the day was mainly the Wolves first round pick in the 2012 NBA Draft they received from Utah.  The Jazz had to give up the lottery protected pick when they made the playoffs with their win over Phoenix on Tuesday.  The talk goes from fixing the Wolves to being somewhat jealous of the Jazz to second guessing past Pup picks.



Subject: Way to go Jazz

Ben 8:15am -

We get Terrance Ross...OR Austin Rivers?


Luke 8:54 am -

In the draft room hear them talk, the coldest story ever told
Somewhere far along this road, Wes lost his job
When we drafted Moe Harkless
Could it be Moe Harkless?
Oh, how could it be Moe Harkless?











Just kidding.  He’s a bit too big of a SF I think.  I do like Ross but see him as a SF next to Ridnour and Rubio and none of them are really slashers.  I guess if we find a slashing wing to replace Ridnour with.

DraftExpress: Terrence Ross' limitations as a ball-handler/shot-creator incredibly obvious today. He's still primarily a spot-up/transition guy right now.

I’m fine with that as our SF because RR is going to have the ball in his hands anyway.  This is what Wes was supposed to be, literally exactly what Wes was supposed to be.  A good defender, open court streaker and knock down spot up shooter.  I hate Wes and his smile.

I guess all this should be prefaced with the statement that I’m completely done with Wes and am convinced that DW is a PF.

Our biggest needs are:

1 – wing with good size that can shoot and defend

2 – wing with decent size that can get to the basket

3 – rim protecting big man


Don’t know about the bigs unless you like Fab, Festus, Henson or Meyers.

Wings projected to go around us or later:

Jeff Taylor sounds a lot like Wes.  Old already, good defender, can’t dribble, disappears for long stretches at times.  No thanks.

Austin Rivers needs the ball in his hands a lot… not a good fit with Rubio?  Same with Tony Wroten.

Don’t want Dion “Randy Foye” Waiters.

Evan Fournier (Euro) don’t know anything.

John Jenkins seems to be a reach.

I think I would trade DW for Brad Beal straight up right now.

I know I would for MKG.


Beal/MKG – love

Lamb – J. like a lot

Ross – like

Harkless/Rivers/D Lamb – like some

Waiters/Jenkins/Taylor/Wroten – pass

Fournier – who knows


Wouldn’t at all be surprised to see a trade this draft.  We also get Memphis pick next year as long as they make the playoffs (almost certain) so we should have 2 picks next year around 15 (ours) and 22 (Memphis) to use in a trade if needed.  I’m ok doing that to get a top player like Beal or MKG, but otherwise, I think it’s fine to keep DW, let him get a full off-season and more minutes (without Beas) next year to work a trade when his value is highest.

Grab up Ross…

RR (Malcolm)

Rid (JJ)

Ross (DW/Wes)

Love (DW)

Pek (Darko)


Derrick 8:57 am -

Ross would be more NBA ready,

Rivers has more upside.


Ben 9:30 am -

I think trying to trade up is a good idea.

Using the 2nd overall pick from last year is a horrible idea to get Beal, I don't see him being anything amazing.  MKG I would be ok with since he'll be a SF slasher.  Then I would look hard at getting a no doubt sniper SG in free agency or small trade...I think you all know who I am thinking of...JJ Redick.

Not sure if anyone will be interested in the top 3 of taking DW for MKG but crazier things have happened.

Otherwise, I take whoever is left between Rivers/Ross.  Will they for sure be better than Wes?  No but what other choice is there?  You could trade back I suppose, try to pick up that SG in that deal and then take Fab Melo at the end of the first round to get a shot blocker to back up Pek.

Plan A (Dream):

Rubio (Lee)

Redick (Ridnour, Wes)

MKG (Wes)

Love (Tolliver/FA PF pick up)

Pek (Some FA defensive minded center...Darko must leave)


Plan B (Most likely to happen):

Rubio (JJ - in scenario A I have him being dealt, Lee)

Rivers/Ross (Wes, Ridnour)

DW (Wes, Webster)

Love (DW)

Pek (Some FA defensive minded center....darko still must leave...Adelman will not let him back in the gym I don't think)


Plan C (Trading back idea):

Rubio (JJ, Lee)

Manny Harris-from Cleveland with the 25th pick..not a great example...but you get where I am going(Ridnour, Wes)

DW (Wes)

Love (DW)

Pek (Fab Melo)


After watching the Jazz last night, if Paul Milsap can play SF for them, DW can play SF for us next year.  I understand Milsap is a smart player, something DW is yet to prove he is, but a full offseason I think DW improves greatly and will be usable at the SF spot, and will likely start there if still here.  Gotta have the most talent on the court as possible.


Luke 10:10 am -

You can’t look at it as the 2nd overall pick from last year.  Picks are more valuable than unproven prospects generally speaking.  I know what you’re saying and think DW can possibly stretch to play SF… maybe, but I see as many problems as benefits doing that.  This isn’t Dirk playing stretch PF and you live with his junk D because he kills the other team’s bigs all night.  At least, we see no signs of other teams SFs forcing him to drive where he inevitably charges over the awaiting big man or has he shot erased in the paint.  DW is not Paul Milsap.  DW sees himself as a star, he rarely hustles.  Milsap is smart and much more versatile/team oriented at this point.  But it’s not a ridiculous thought.  And I’m cool with seeing what DW can become next year.  While his athleticism was greatly exaggerated, I think he can figure out how to be much more effective than he was this year more consistently.

So we differ a lot in as much as I have almost no faith in him as a successful SF the way I would like to see, but would like nothing more than to be proven wrong.  That being said, I am impatient and like the idea of rounding out the roster better ASAP.  So I would rather have a better wing than Rid/Wes than a high potential player backing up Love and stretching to play the wing.  Also, I would guess if you called Toronto and said “DW for #5?”  I’m guessing you hear a dial tone.  I also would be in favor of Beal at 2 and finding a transition terror for a SF that can run with Rubio via FA – although it is not a great year for that.  It’s all about adding that 3rd player, if you think you have him in DW, I don’t see it yet.  If you think you can package DW and other pieces to get him, I’m all for it.  I just want to get him!

Ridnour, DW, Love and Pek is about as poor a transition team to put around RR as you can muster.  Zero speed and one guy that can catch a lob if the wind is just right and he has a chance to get his body control down perfectly.

I think Beal would be a great fit.  We aren’t afraid to play smaller 2s obviously.  And he can shoot, has a well-rounded game and is a competitor.  Reminds me of the kind of player that James Harden is for OKC, and I love James Harden.  Some dude on below...

"…………..Beal didn’t surprise me in his success at his lone season at Florida or his NBA prospects but he did surprise me some in his game. Coming into the season I thought Bradley had the look of a complete SG in the mold of Eric Gordon or even Ray Allen he has been compared to but as the season went along he profiles as less of a traditional SG than I thought. At 6ft3 200lbs Beal has a powerful build and puts it to use as he put up outstanding rebounding numbers for a guard, Beal also shows that he is a physical and affective defender at his position. He has brothers that play NCAA football and his build is similar to Dwayne Wade, wide shoulders, long arms, and a thick lower half, he is not quite as explosive as wade but he is a smooth, yet powerful athlete that has no problem getting to the hoop when he gets a crease. Despite being a new age unique power guard Beal is also very comfortable on the perimeter he is an accurate jump shooter with range out to the 3 pt line, and good FT shooter, very good looking shooting stroke. Beal has great intangibles, makes players around him better, is competitive and consistent."

"Beal is a couple inches short of ideal height but it isn’t a problem because he plays bigger. He is not much of an iso guy, he needs a play designed for him or someone to create in order to score, or he finds buckets by out hustling or making athletic plays. Beal is not a guy that can get a good shot for himself at will, for a guard that is projected top 10 or even top 5 he may be limited as a scorer and be a team’s 3rd option instead of 1st or 2nd that you prefer when drafting this high."

I call Beal a power guard, not many in that category, maybe Bill Walker Q Richardson but it is hard to make a comparison. I definitely see Beal as a starting SG, possibly in All Star if his outside shot keeps improving. Beal will be a good player on both ends of the court and with his intangibles and youth, he is a good pick 5-10.

Agree on Darko, but NOBODY is going to trade for him and I don’t know if Glen Taylor will relish buying him out.  But he just really does need to go.


Ben 10:36 am -

We'll agree to disagree on DW playing SF.

We both agree that if we can package him for a better option that fits better with the current team, do it.

We both also agree that if that package isn't there (I doubt it is) we want to see what a full off-season with a very good coaching staff can do with a guy who wasn't quite ready to control his athleticism in his first year in the NBA.

To me, he has ball handling (amazed in his pre-draft workout), quickness (matches SG Iman Shumpert in draft combine sprint/agility workouts) to play SF.  He needs to do what he said he would do, and lose the weight this offseason, go on the KLove workout/diet.  I really hope they both go workout together all offseason in LA as both will likely be there in the offseason.  With KLove's work ethic on improving, and Williams athleticism he can definitely figure out SF.  There will always be matchups that will force him off the court if another team goes small, but on most nights he will be fine.

Ridnour needs to be replaced at SG, no doubt we need a significant upgrade in a backcourt partner for Rubio.

Love I think is a good transition combo with Rubio, if around them there are more athletes/shooters than just DW.  Pek has earned his spot and actually rim runs very well, so that leaves that Ridnour replacement we were just discussing.  Love pairs nicely because 50% of the time he gets the board, 100% of the time he goes for it, and will play outlet guy/trailer for the three in transition.

Ross seems most realistic and if he lives up to his Wes Johnson like pre-draft profile, he will fit that mold just fine.

Beal was sold as a freshman going into Florida as a Ray Allen type sniper.  Then shot 34%....from college range.  When I watched him he never impressed me, especially at 5-10 range.  TO ME, he sounds like he does somethings better now than Ross, but much of the same things but at 3-4 less inches of height and a ton higher up in the draft.  I stay put and go Ross.

Personally I don't think Rivers makes any sense for us.

There has to be a way to buy out Darko.  Hasn't he just been in street clothes for being too out of shape to play the past month?  Adelman will pay the buyout himself.


Derrick 10:38 am -

Too much writing guys.  This ADD guy can't handle it all.  I'm sure it's interesting though.


Luke 10:50 am -

I watched some FL tournament games but never noticed Beal.  So I’m not saying he’s a can’t miss.  I like his profile is all so I am no authority.

I’m not 100% sure DW can’t be our SF, I’m really skeptical.

He promised he was going to get to 225 for the season and play SF.  All last summer he said that.  I remember watching his physique closely (dohkay) during the offseason into the year and just saw a big thick guy. Then in an interview in the first few games he told someone, “I’ve been working out hard and added a lot of strength, I’m at about 242.”

Throughout the year, visually he seemed to trim off some weight and become leaner, but he is still a big thick guy.  Love is about the same height and took off 30 LBs.  I don’t think DW has 30 LBs to lose really.  But you have done a good job of calming me down.  I think I can see that line up succeeding and it gives us flexibility contractually and in the line up.

If Derrick would take the 2 minutes it takes to read 20 sentences, he could help us with some comments on Ross.  I like the sounds of him, but didn’t notice him much in the NIT Gophs game.

RR (JJ / Malcolm)


DW (Wes)

Love (Tolliver)

Pek (?)

All you gotta do is resign Tolly and land Ross.

Then find a cheap back up big.

Ben 11:02 am -

Mystery Player Wolves passed on in last year's draft -

6-5 200 lbs SG

2011/12 Rookie Stats:

46 games started/55 played

12.7 ppg

43% FG

31% 3PT

38.5 inch vert.

7'1" wingspan


Luke 11:05 am -












Derrick 11:09 am -

Ben has loved him (Marshon Brooks) since day one.

Wish he was on the Wolves too!


Ben 11:07 am -

Ding ding ding!

Sure would be nice to have him in the fold right now huh?

Trade back this year get Melo to be our defensive shot blocker.


While I am hindsight-ing past Wolves picks.

How much fun is Gordon Hayward to watch?  Dude does a bit of everything, hustles his butt off, is SMART and read and reacts well (hello Wes Johnson sucks at all of that).

Wish we'd taken him at 4 over Wes....(total hindsight 20/20 never would've said this at the time)

Ugh...can we talk about Duke basketball now?  I am getting depressed...oh wait...Andre Dawkins may red shirt next year....we didn't get Shabazz....we didn't get Tony Parker....Michael Gbinije transferred.................................................STOB.

Luke 11:12 am -

2 years ago, Samuel wanted James Anderson.  Spurs took him.  didn’t do squat.

Last year, he wanted Brooks.  He would be great right now.

I wanted Alec Burkes and like Brooks a lot too.  Especially when he fell that far.


Ben 11:13 am -

You think the Jazz would take DW and Barea for Gordon Hayward?


Luke 11:18 am -

Probably not.

They have so many big forwards already…

Al and Milsap are both coming up on their last year next year.

I guess if everything pans out, you let them both go get overpaid somewhere else?





D Harris


No superstar, but well-balanced and well drafted too.


Ben 11:20 am -

I fell in love with Hayward last night.

And I feel a big deal coming from the Jazz in the next year or two.  So much young quality talent with upside.  Package a couple for a star to pair with it.

Oh and they have the 8th pick in this year's draft still....or higher depending on the lottery.


Luke 11:23 am -

Watch them take Sullinger LOL

I think they might take a look at Lillard or K Marshall.

Harris just has 1 year left too.


Ben 11:27 am -

Expiring deals + loads of young assets = ability to trade for star.

If I am them, I trade up and get MKG.

from ESPN.

Luke 11:44 am -

They’re in a good position.

Who do you want in the finals?

I want-






Ben 12:11 pm -

I honestly couldn't care less...

OKC vs Chicago Finals


Luke 12:17 pm -

I don’t really care either.

But I am excited for the playoffs.

Nba playoffs-nba draft and then nothing until the fall.


Ben 12:25 pm -

Ugh...yeah the summer is going to be long...


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